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Phill20d

2.0d engine

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Hi guys

Is the 2.0 d engine in the G30/31 the B47 carried over from the F11 /10 if so are there any significant improvements or is it as is. 
 

Paul

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Hi, so funnily enough I was just going to post on or around this subject...

 

Over the past 6 weeks (for reasons I won't go into) I've had cause to be given both a 2017 520d G31 and a late 2018 / early 2019 520d G31. The difference in between the two, for me, was immense. I currently have a 2018 G32 630d xdrive (which replaced F10 525d) and still have an F11 520d - the G31 definitely feels lighter than the F11 with regards to steering / handling and performance, but the newer G31 felt so much nicer to drive, much smoother and more responsive whilst also being far more economical as far as I could see. This wasn't simply down to the age / servicing / mileage, this was something deeper.

 

I was in at BMW Tunbridge Wells today and asked specifically about the difference (I'm considering shopping in my F11 for an 18-month-old G31) and was told, after some digging, that this is all in engine management across a range of modules. I asked if I bought a 67 plate car whether they would update, they said it could be done but they wouldn't do it due to the risk of failure in the flashing process?!?

 

Anyone else experienced this difference? does anyone have any more info on the subject? If I did summon the pennies to swap the car, is anyone confident on being able to perform this upgrade?

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20 minutes ago, Jelec said:

a 2017 520d G31 and a late 2018 / early 2019 520d G31. The difference in between the two, for me, was immense

 

There would be absolutely no difference in the engine or the ECU. Both would be running the B47D20 engine as would a post July 2014 F1x car. The only difference you would get would be a different flash on the gearbox. The 525d also runs on this engine but this has a different tune and slightly different piping to the ECU if i recall correctly. 

 

That would make it feel noticeably different in some case. My F10 was flashed to the newest software throughout when I had complained about gearbox judder when going into reverse. Not only did they install new software which tweaked the iDrive, they also flashed the gearbox. Changes were smoother and quicker. Economy also improved. Then the car went back in and I never saw the lemon again, ended up rejecting it. 

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So have you driven an early and late G31 back to back or spoken to anyone with first-hand knowledge on any differences / updates? The 525d has a second turbo, but that’s largely irrelevant to my earlier post.

 

To reiterate, an early and much more recent G31 520d are night and day. I’m sure you’re right that the gearbox will play a significant part, but I really think it’s more than just that. The engine note is different through the range, it’s quieter and smoother (immediately noticeable at idle) and the cars were averaging 34mpg and 44mpg respectively. The two cars, which I drove back to back as my daily driver for more than a couple weeks each were so markedly different to drive I made a specific point of asking my local dealer who confirmed via the workshop manager that “this is all in engine management across a range of modules.”

 

I completely accept that very often you can’t trust what dealers say, with that said, the story was convincing and he agreed on the significant difference in the way they drive.

 

So again, does anyone else have direct experience of driving an early and late G31 20d and does anyone have any more info? Has anyone updated all modules on an early car and noticed the difference?

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1 hour ago, Jelec said:

So have you driven an early and late G31 back to back or spoken to anyone with first-hand knowledge on any differences / updates? The 525d has a second turbo, but that’s largely irrelevant to my earlier post.

 

To reiterate, an early and much more recent G31 520d are night and day. I’m sure you’re right that the gearbox will play a significant part, but I really think it’s more than just that. The engine note is different through the range, it’s quieter and smoother (immediately noticeable at idle) and the cars were averaging 34mpg and 44mpg respectively. The two cars, which I drove back to back as my daily driver for more than a couple weeks each were so markedly different to drive I made a specific point of asking my local dealer who confirmed via the workshop manager that “this is all in engine management across a range of modules.”

 

I completely accept that very often you can’t trust what dealers say, with that said, the story was convincing and he agreed on the significant difference in the way they drive.

 

So again, does anyone else have direct experience of driving an early and late G31 20d and does anyone have any more info? Has anyone updated all modules on an early car and noticed the difference?


I had a May 2017 production car and drove both 68 and 19 plate cars as loaners when mine was in for a warranty claim several times. I wouldn’t say the difference is noticeable as you say, although my car was updated every time it was in. The risk of flashing process is utter bollocks, it takes 60 minutes tops. Typical salesman talk to sell you a newer car and you’re falling right for it
 

if you have vin numbers for both cars You had (loan emails will have them) check on RealOem. Compare that the engine, Ecu and gearbox will all be the same, it’s all a case of software updates which have slight tweaks and the gearbox makes a huge difference. 
 

for example, I drove a 330d before and after an Alpina flash, transformed the car.

 

there is no reason why an engine would be redeveloped mid life. It’s too costly of an exercise.

Edited by sjak92

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Well, there seems to have been some miscommunication here. As I stated, I was told by the dealer this is all in software and that was what I believed. Wasn't falling for anything, I was intending to get an older car, I am looking for someone with experience of updating all modules on an early example as my local dealer refuses to do it, hence the ?!?

 

With that said, I have read the following articles, which suggest the engine has in fact been revised:

 

https://www.bmwblog.com/2017/11/20/four-cylinder-bmw-diesels-get-first-big-update/#disqus_thread

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/bmw-b37-bmw-b47-diesel-engines-get-tu1-twin-turbo-upgrade-121785.html

 

“The modified design of cylinders and pistons, adjusted balancer shafts, and optimized combustion provide a significant reduction in engine noise and even more effectively prevent the already dramatically reduced diesel rumble from recent years.”

 

This would be in line with my description above no?

 

The 525d has two turbos according to anything I have ever read about that engine. A simple google confirms:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_B47

 

"The B47 engine is part of the modular family of engines, along with the B38B48, and B58.[1] The B47 complies with the Euro 6 emissions standard, and features a dual overhead camshaft with 4 valves per cylinder and a single turbocharger; while 165 kW (224 PS; 221 hp) and 170 kW (231 PS; 228 hp) engines feature twin-turbochargers."

 

I remain open to the possibility that the B47TÜ1 is not found in new G31 520d, the dealer made no mention of this. I would however appreciate some hard references. I've had 4 different BMW diesels over the past 15 years and have had the opportunity to drive several others. My experience of the two cars as detailed above was not my imagination. I'll see if I can get the vins of the two cars from the VRNs in the morning to see if that can shed any light on it as you suggest!

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So, I couldn't find the VIN of the older car, however I have since found a German forum stating specifically that 520d G3x have newer engine as detailed above from build dates of July 18.

 

https://www.motor-talk.de/forum/ist-im-520d-schon-der-b47tue1-verbaut-t6229471.html?page=4

 

If this is true (I haven't been able to find anything on a BMW site, like a press release) it would seem regrettably this is not just in software!

 

Again, would be very happy to be proved wrong on this - my preference would be to buy a cheaper, earlier G31 and update...

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have you got the vin of the newer car? My old May 2017 build list the engine as B47O using a vin decoder 

 

https://www.mdecoder.com/decode/g868825

 

a Jan 2019 production 3 series (which would be after the date you say the new engine would be in)

 

https://www.mdecoder.com/decode/a967785

 

still runs a B47O

 

An older 16 plate 320d 

 

https://www.mdecoder.com/decode/k713070

 

All running the same engine

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Clearly seems that there has been some update to the B47 but from the vin numbers I can see, they dont apply to UK cars?

 

Any chance that one of the 520d's you were running was remapped?

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2 hours ago, sjak92 said:

 

 

Any chance that one of the 520d's you were running was remapped?

exactly what I was thinking 

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1 hour ago, Phill20d said:

exactly what I was thinking 

Well I don't think so, one was dealer stock and for sale, one was an enterprise car provided by BMW, unless the enterprise car was detuned, but it was less economical so I don't think so. The fact that the service department knew exactly what I meant when I raised the difference would suggest it wasn't specific to these two cars.

If you go to realoem and manually select the car model you get the following:

G31>520d>09/2017> you can ONLY choose engine B47

G31>520d>07/2018> you can choose EITHER B47 OR B47D

G31>520d>03/2019> you can ONLY choose engine B47D

This applies to both left and right hand drive vehicles.

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11 hours ago, Phill20d said:

Mines is June 2017 and has Adblue

 May 2017 had adblue. 
 

if OP is saying that the Enterprise car was the one that felt worse (as I understand) then we can close the topic. Their cars are dogs. 
 

had a 330d loaner with 20k miles on it, felt like that car was on its last legs. 
 

also had a very long term 520d loaner from them during my F10 days (run it for 8 weeks) the car had 60k miles when delivered to me, did not have a single service carried out.

 

 

Edited by sjak92

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It was an enterprise car with 20K on the car, and add blue. Regardless, according to everying the I have referenced above, the engine has been revised. I would very much like to be wrong on this, because I want to buy any earlier G31.

 

What I'm really looking for is someone who currently has access to an early and late G31 520d, drive them back to back and let us know your experience! Alternatively a BMW technical source in the know.

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8 hours ago, Jelec said:

It was an enterprise car with 20K on the car, and add blue. Regardless, according to everying the I have referenced above, the engine has been revised. I would very much like to be wrong on this, because I want to buy any earlier G31.

 

What I'm really looking for is someone who currently has access to an early and late G31 520d, drive them back to back and let us know your experience! Alternatively a BMW technical source in the know.

 

Just go an get an early G31. Have it remapped for circa £400 and you will have a 2.0 diesel with 220 BHP plus and close to 500nm of torque. An early model is likely to be almost out of warranty in any event. Even if the engine has been revised and even if it makes such a monumental difference (which i don't think it would in all fairness) a remapped car will be even better beyond that if done by a reputable company and a rolling road. 

 

I dont deny the fact that the B47 has been revised, you have clearly shown links to stuff which seemingly confirms it has, im just not 100% sure if all of that is applicable to UK based cars? Seems that vin numbers of 2019 cars dont support that but its all a moot point if you're not in the market for a new car but a late 2016/early 2017 build.

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On 10/21/2019 at 9:41 PM, Jelec said:

So have you driven an early and late G31 back to back or spoken to anyone with first-hand knowledge on any differences / updates? The 525d has a second turbo, but that’s largely irrelevant to my earlier post.

 

To reiterate, an early and much more recent G31 520d are night and day. I’m sure you’re right that the gearbox will play a significant part, but I really think it’s more than just that. The engine note is different through the range, it’s quieter and smoother (immediately noticeable at idle) and the cars were averaging 34mpg and 44mpg respectively. The two cars, which I drove back to back as my daily driver for more than a couple weeks each were so markedly different to drive I made a specific point of asking my local dealer who confirmed via the workshop manager that “this is all in engine management across a range of modules.”

 

I completely accept that very often you can’t trust what dealers say, with that said, the story was convincing and he agreed on the significant difference in the way they drive.

 

So again, does anyone else have direct experience of driving an early and late G31 20d and does anyone have any more info? Has anyone updated all modules on an early car and noticed the difference?

Hi Jelec 

I have an early 2018 G31 2.0D and when it was in for its service the dealer loaned me an almost new (600 Mile) G30 2.0d and I used it for my normal daily commute same driving style etc and although not much difference in performance there did seem to be a big difference in economy I mentioned this to the dealer on returning it and they advised that my car had received some updates whilst they had had it in and I should expect to see an overall improvement

which to be fair I have G31 not quite as economic as the G30 maybe down to shape and aerodynamics  

   

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