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cal368

Respray advice.

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So, I've been meaning to sort out my 52 plate e39 M5 for a while now after 4 years of ownership it's long overdue.  It's in pretty good nick body wise but the bottom of the front doors are bubbling up (I have four replacement doors that came off an M5 from Ireland already).  A repair job a couple of years ago didn't stop the rust for that long.  Anyway, some A@£$hole has ran into my rear bumper at the osr today and cracked the bumper and scuffed the quarter panel.  So I'm going to use this as the kick up the backside I need to get it into a good body shop and treat it to a good quality respray and get any rust removed.

 

Looking for your thoughts and advice really, it's a daily car at the moment which has meant me not treating it as well as I should have if I'm honest.  But after this it won't be!  It's Carbon Black, which I do like still and think will look great if it's done well.  However I'm toying with the idea of maybe changing the colour as I really want a proper job with the windows out etc.  So I've one chance. Nothing earth shattering, but I'm really taken by the new Tanzanite Blue that BMW brought out recently.

 

tanzanitelbue-m4-5-750x500.jpg

 

tumblr_nmdwe1c3RU1t7ro8vo1_1280.jpg

 

So what's your thoughts on the colour change?

 

What do you think would be a good price for

 

          a )  A good quality windows out respray with mild rust removal if required (I'm thinking possibly jacking points?)

 

          b )  Colour change with same as above?

 

Also I'm in Glasgow, so does anyone have any recommendations for a good body shop?  I am however prepared to travel to a reputable garage anywhere in the UK if I can't find one locally.

 

Lastly, do you think a colour change albeit fairly restrained and not a million miles away from the original would affect the value adversely if at some point in the future I were to part with the car?

 

Cheers in advance, looking forward to your replies and also getting ready to duck for the incoming abuse for my heresy!

 

Paul.

Edited by cal368

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With the colour change I think it depends on whether the rest of the car is original or not. If the car is modified in other respects, it might not be an issue at all.

 

Personally a colour change would not bother me, assuming I liked it, even on an otherwise original car.

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Unless it is full original parts, low milage etc i can't imagine a proper job colour change will make too much difference to the value as long as you don't go some daft colour.

 

I do like carbon black but also that blue is nice as well, tough choice in my eyes

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I wouldn't do it because I'd worry about resale value and more importantly that it would sit around for a long time if selling.

Also, I think the non-original colour will become more of an issue as time goes on and enthusiasts are seeking good original cars from the dwindling number of cars left.

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I've just had the exterior of my E34 resprayed in it's original colour. All external panels including roof done. The glasshouse was soft masked and the door jambs weren’t touched.  

 

I’m doing all the strip and refit myself.

 

I paid cash for the labour and got the paint at cost. I’m not sure I paid for consumables at all.

 

Despite all of this the cost was over £1,200. Paint materials alone were nearly £700.

 

I know that doesn’t sound like much for a respray but, being that I went same colour;

 

-the door and boot jambs weren’t touched

-the internal surfaces of panels weren’t touched

-the engine bay wasn’t touched

-the glass remained fitted

-there’s fewer painted parts on an E34 SE than there is on an E39 M5

 

To do a proper job of a colour change, without the freebies and discounts I wangled, the cost must be huge. Surely four grand minimum.

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Thanks for all the replies.  I've found a bodyshop that as a guide price reckons £2-2500 for a windows out, sill liners off respray in original colour, told me the cost and time involved in a colour swap would be prohibitively expensive.  Obviously if he has to treat any rust this would incur an extra charge, as will the bodywork repairs that need doing due to the accident damage.

 

So I'll get another estimate before I take the plunge but it will be staying Carbon Black. 

 

Does this seem a reasonable price?  I appreciate the costs in Southern England may be a bit higher than up here in Scotland.

 

Cheers again.

 

Paul.

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To most a colour change is a no but if u do it properly and choose a nice colour it should look nice. Be prepared to possibly lose money come resale... Or maybe not, depending on buyer.

Had my LMB facelift M5 sprayed steel metallic grey from the E46 M3. Looked good, only part that stayed orig colour was engine bay but even then the paint in the bay is a matt colour so barely noricable.

Me personally I'd stick with a OE BMW black.

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Dan...Seems to be good feedback on them over on Pistonheads.  https://www.facebook.com/Touch-Ups-108511155891859/  They don't have a website. But most paint shops either seem to not have one or have a crappy one that looks like it was built in 1996!!  But I will get at least a couple more quotes.  I liked the guy but they can't take the car in until April.  Might be a good sign I suppose.

 

Black9....I'm pretty certain I'll be sticking with OEM now.  If I were to change it, I would really want it done in the engine bay as well. Thinking with my head, the extra cost plus the possible loss of value if I were to sell the car just doesn't add up.

 

I've mulled this over for a while and nearly pulled the trigger a few times.  At one point got quoted 5k which for a respray in the same colour which seemed way over the top.  I will let you all know what I do and post a few pics if I can.

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Hi,

 

As per most responses above, the 'general' gist is always automatically stated as 'no' and 'stay to oem' and for all the reasons above. This is absolutely fine of course! However, 

 

Many 'discerning' potential purchasers of these cars will also walk away once they know the car has had a respray. This becomes more apparent for when asking prices are increased/inflated etc. So it'll cut both ways, but I'd agree to a lesser extent than if it was a colour change. 

 

If your M5 is one of those examples where everything is absolutely pristine, impeccably kept, as close to oem as possible with a good spec and well below average/low mileage, then I'd also suggest sticking with the OEM colour as well. Before your car goes into the bodyshop, take lots and lots of high quality and clear photographs of the car and highlight any areas which need attention. When the bodyshop have it, see if you can have them take pictures of what they find in terms of extra areas of attention and what they do to remedy things prior to preparation for paint. This will give you evidence of how the car was prior to the work in case you decide to sell sooner or later. Another thing I'd mention is that speak to the bodyshop and discuss the quality of the paint and materials to be used. There is differing levels of paint quality - its NOT all the same! I'd suggest going for higher quality paint. 

 

If you are planning to keep the car longer term and perhaps don't really want to sell it for years, then do consider a different colour. Do the same basics as above to document it, and then once prepped, you can put on the colour you want. Keeping things looking oem but 'slightly' different is an excellent idea - Ruby Black gives a Red/Purple tinge instead of Blue and I think it first appeared as an E60 Individual colour (I may be wrong!) There's also the potential to choose one of the actual E39 Individual ones - only one right hand drive example made of Black Sapphire Metallic and CosmosSchwarz made respectively ! If you go away from the 'blacks', then there wasn't a single RHD Atlantis Blue example !  If you are more daring, then other BMW colours, like Tanzanite as you've already picked out as well as all the others you could go for!

 

A couple more options for you are to fix the local corrosion spots and paint and then giving the car to a reputable paint correction specialist to work their magic all over it. Look at the video's on the KDS Keltec website for instance! 

 

You could fix the local corrosion and prep the car and then have a high quality wrap done. This would allow you to have a different colour and also allow you to save up more funds to do a higher quality paint job later. 

 

Cheers, Dennis!

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Cheers Dennis, 

 

Plenty of food for thought there.  I'll see what running it by a couple of other body shops come up with price wise.  Saying that, price isn't the main driver of this, equally I don't want to get shafted so a bit of research over the next week to be done I think.

 

As for the car, it's just turned over 120,000 miles so it's not exactly low miles but not German taxi mileage either, it has a full BMW main dealer service history.  Mechanically it's sound, generally speaking the body is solid, underneath appears to be too. The interior is very clean with no dodgy pixels and everything works. It's completely OEM as it stands apart from an Alpina short shift kit I believe which was fitted by the previous owner.  In my opinion, worth spending a bit of money on.

 

You've got me thinking colour change again now haha...bloody hell!

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£2.5k and this

 

I liked the guy but they can't take the car in until April.  Might be a good sign I suppose.

 

sounds pretty good to me. There's significant potential for budget creep particularly once you add corrosion into the mix but that's a good starting point.

 

speak to the bodyshop and discuss the quality of the paint and materials to be used. There is differing levels of paint quality - its NOT all the same! I'd suggest going for higher quality paint. 

 

The place that did mine had all kinds of repairs standards to conform to so they didn't have any rubbish paint. Even so, the painters had a preferred more expensive lacquer made by Sikkens / Akso Nobel which is better than the stuff they usually use. In the end we used their normal base and colour and then lavishly applied about a litre and a half of this £300/litre lacquer over the top.

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2.5k - 4k would be my ball park depending on the condition of the car and how much rust there is in places you can't see

As an ex bodyshop owner it always came in at that sort of money for a top quality job

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You'll need to factor in some extra for bits that break or are not reusable once removed. Things like the clips that hold the rain channels in will probably break and the front and rear window seals will need replacing if you remove the glass. The rubber seals that go over the top of the rear door and down the front edge are very difficult to remove without kinking the internal metal strip, once that happens it will never be totally flat again. You may find that some of the shadow line trim gets bent when it's removed too, and the wing mirror bolts can corrode and seize solid. Other little things like the bungs for the roundals all add up.

Not saying you'll need to replace all of these, just factor in some extra for unexpected parts.

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The other cost to factor in is that once you've got some lovely shiny new paint, you'll find it impossible to refit tired, old trim. Budget to replace, well, everything.

I thought that, but wasn't going to say it!

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Spoke to guy this afternoon at a bodyshop in East Kilbride. goo.gl/ZVDQIE (Link to Facebook page) Classic Porsche specialist, some lovely bit and pieces on show.  Saw a newly painted MGB Cabrio I think.  Paint job was outstanding.  Place was immaculate.  The man I spoke to seemed to know exactly what buttons to push.  Before I even said exactly what I wanted he told me that he would only take the job on if it was a doors/bonnet/boot/bumpers and windows out job.  All the trims removed and door jambs painted and returned to me in pristine condition.  He was a fair bit pricier at around £5k without any associated new trims and fiddly new little bits.  Which I reckon budgeting wise would possibly need another £1000+ possibly.  So could end up the thick end of 6 or 7 grand.  I am sorely tempted but I don't know If I'm being dazzled by all the shiny things on show and whether that is justifiable on a car worth arguably £6-7k at the moment.  Really got to make a decision whether a £3-4k job would be good enough now?!

 

RichardP and Dan, you are both spot on I think I've always had an idea that a contingency for broken and or tired parts would be required.  Little bits of faded trims will no doubt stand out like a sore thumb when this is all done. Wiper arms in particular are so faded they are desperately in need of replacing.

 

DirtyHarry88.  I can understand where you are coming from and don't totally disagree with you.  But the car is regularly serviced and for what it's worth still on a full BMW service history. I do appreciate a huge bill could be around the next corner.  But If we were to think that way none of us would be driving high performance M cars...never mind 14 year old ones.  I want to keep this and make it a weekend car and have a banger for work. I think it/they deserve(s) better than to be allowed to deteriorate into a shabby mess, just my thoughts.

 

Anyway.

 

I really appreciate all your input and I will be putting the car in wherever in the next month or two.  I will try document the process and post it here for you to see what comes of this all.

 

Cheers,

 

Paul.

Edited by cal368

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If you're going to do it, do it right.. Take it to someone like the specialist you mention, pay way more than you want to pay, because a £3k paint job will ruin your car forever.

I say do the colour change, and do the door shuts.. At the end of the day, BMW did individual colours so you can too.. If it's a damn fine job it will not reduce the value of the car, it may not increase it, but i don't think it won't reduce it..

Edited by DriftFactory

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When I painted my car it came in at about £7k. That was for a top notch job with all new trims. The cost for painting was around £5k the rest was for trims/repairs. You'll also want to refurbish the wheels unless they're mint so factor in the cost of that.

I would also set a deadline for the work to be done. Never ever tell a bodyshop that there is no rush to get it done. A mate of mine waited 5 months to get his E34 back and then it was the wrong colour!

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