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Neil.D

i Drive problems / frying of electronics by water ingress

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last week, get the message "transmission fault" and "PDC fault" on my 525d lci 2008. Google it and find this thread.

Go in the boot and strip it thanks to the info here.

I find 1 inch of water. The PDC is not exacly in the water bit got some splashes.

I unplug it.

The car immmediatly stops sending error message.

I put the PDC in a bowl of rice and drive all week without it (only diff being the lack of PDC).

Last night, got the PDC back on the car... with some electrical spray on the connectors.. all working!

 

Thanks for the info on this thread!

 

My turn to help. I wonder where the water came from having no sunroof... I quickly found it came from  a disloged seal at the top of the boot. So, check yours seal from time to tme.

Edited by reggie59

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Thanks to you Neil for this thread. Another owner got charged £800 by BMW dealer for doing what I did. To be fair, the dealer probably (almost missed the p) replaced the PDC as a "precautional measure" instead of a packet of rice from Tesco ;-).

 

I would have not realised what the issue without this thread.

 

Reggie59

 

PS: the rice idea came from the day I dropped my iphone in the bath... and googled what to do. Amusing to see where people have managed to drop their iphone... highy entertaining.

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Hi All - Unfortunately my E61 520d M Sport Touring has been affected by water ingress in the spare wheel well and my local BMW Dealer are now listing a bill totaling Â£900 after I received a Level Control Systems Failure error message.

 

It seems I need a EHC unit to correct the Air Suspension, as well as coding/programming for it and a full strip down and water test of the boot. They have advised that the bill could be higher depending on a what they do and do not find!!!

 

The car is only 4 years old and I purchased the BMW insured warranty (Full Comprehensive Cover) at a cost of £700 when the original 3 year warranty expired but it seems that it will not cover this issue as it is water damage and probably caused by seals or weather strips which are excluded from the warranty.

 

All seems a bit poor really, considering the car has been main dealer serviced and was last inspected for it's MOT in December 2012 and nothing was noted.

 

Anyone think I have a case to take this to BMW UK Customer Services ?

 

Thanks for you help

Steve

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Hi All - Unfortunately my E61 520d M Sport Touring has been affected by water ingress in the spare wheel well and my local BMW Dealer are now listing a bill totaling Â£900 after I received a Level Control Systems Failure error message.

 

It seems I need a EHC unit to correct the Air Suspension, as well as coding/programming for it and a full strip down and water test of the boot. They have advised that the bill could be higher depending on a what they do and do not find!!!

 

The car is only 4 years old and I purchased the BMW insured warranty (Full Comprehensive Cover) at a cost of £700 when the original 3 year warranty expired but it seems that it will not cover this issue as it is water damage and probably caused by seals or weather strips which are excluded from the warranty.

 

All seems a bit poor really, considering the car has been main dealer serviced and was last inspected for it's MOT in December 2012 and nothing was noted.

 

Anyone think I have a case to take this to BMW UK Customer Services ?

 

Thanks for you help

Steve

in the olden days, the garage would have checked that the spare wheel was road worthy and would have seen the water... now BMW puts run flat so it can put expensive electronics in the spare wheel well... that would be a great chat during "the news" at top gear. 

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Got me worried so I've just checked out my E60 57 reg LCI took everything apart and realised I don't have the hoses fitted in that area at all. All I can see is the hole blanked off with a grommet.  I've searched around the area and the hoses are nowhere to be seen and the area is bone dry....phew!

 

It seems like they re-designed the drainage on the LCI's

Edited by leew88

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Hi All - Unfortunately my E61 520d M Sport Touring has been affected by water ingress in the spare wheel well and my local BMW Dealer are now listing a bill totaling Â£900 after I received a Level Control Systems Failure error message.

 

It seems I need a EHC unit to correct the Air Suspension, as well as coding/programming for it and a full strip down and water test of the boot. They have advised that the bill could be higher depending on a what they do and do not find!!!

 

The car is only 4 years old and I purchased the BMW insured warranty (Full Comprehensive Cover) at a cost of £700 when the original 3 year warranty expired but it seems that it will not cover this issue as it is water damage and probably caused by seals or weather strips which are excluded from the warranty.

 

All seems a bit poor really, considering the car has been main dealer serviced and was last inspected for it's MOT in December 2012 and nothing was noted.

 

Anyone think I have a case to take this to BMW UK Customer Services ?

 

Thanks for you help

Steve

Do you have a sunroof? Because if the tubes block up which we all agree is a design fault then surely it's worth getting snotty over to BMW HQ

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Hi All - Unfortunately my E61 520d M Sport Touring has been affected by water ingress in the spare wheel well and my local BMW Dealer are now listing a bill totaling Â£900 after I received a Level Control Systems Failure error message.

 

It seems I need a EHC unit to correct the Air Suspension, as well as coding/programming for it and a full strip down and water test of the boot. They have advised that the bill could be higher depending on a what they do and do not find!!!

 

The car is only 4 years old and I purchased the BMW insured warranty (Full Comprehensive Cover) at a cost of £700 when the original 3 year warranty expired but it seems that it will not cover this issue as it is water damage and probably caused by seals or weather strips which are excluded from the warranty.

 

All seems a bit poor really, considering the car has been main dealer serviced and was last inspected for it's MOT in December 2012 and nothing was noted.

 

Anyone think I have a case to take this to BMW UK Customer Services ?

 

Thanks for you help

Steve

Steve, sorry to hear about your problem.  If you see my posts above it might be worth trying to dry everything out yourself first.  My problems were just like yours and it has now resolved - almost anyway, and the car is quite usable.  By not changing the expensive 'black boxes' there has been no need for expensive BMW re-programming either.  When I said almost resolved it is because I have had intermittent problems.  That is that when I put the key into the ignition, the system would re-set itself and so all trip data, clocks etc (not odometer) would go to zero and need to be re-set.  This was happening frequently for a few weeks, but has now ceased.  So obviously there has been some damage somewhere.  However it did not affect the driveability of the car at all, and I don't have a wedge of money to spend on rectifying such a minor fault at the moment.

 

Jim 

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Thanks for the follow-up everyone - Unfortunately I do not have Sunroof and after a call to BMW UK, they seem to think it is a seal or weather strip that has allowed the water to enter the spare wheel well and therefore it isn't covered under the BMW warranty. 

 

The latest from the dealer is that water tests have been carried out and that the technician found water ingress through the rear boot/tailgate panel seam and that the rear bumper would now need to be removed for further investigation. They added that the repair may take some time once they have determined the cause.

 

I wonder would the "panel seam" be covered by the warranty ? Seems bad for a car that was registered in December 2008 to have a panel seam go ??

 

Thanks all

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Got me worried so I've just checked out my E60 57 reg LCI took everything apart and realised I don't have the hoses fitted in that area at all. All I can see is the hole blanked off with a grommet.  I've searched around the area and the hoses are nowhere to be seen and the area is bone dry....phew!

 

It seems like they re-designed the drainage on the LCI's

The e60 sunroof drain hoses drain out on the back side of the front tire wheel well,, and the rears drain out in front of the rear tire wheel well.... I moved my modules out just as preventive maintenece and avoid that issue,

The way to check the roof drains is,,  for the front drains,, park your car with the front of the car on a downward incline. open the sunroof and pour alittle water on both sides on the inside of the sunroof tracks , the water should drain out somewhere behind the front tires.... To check the rear drains park ur car on a upward incline and pour water on the sunroof tracks and water should drain out in front of the rear wheels...  if water drains out on all four sides drain hoses are clear,, If water doesnt drain out then they are clogged,,,,

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This is a really informative post and I think the OP should be knighted for such a detailed description  :)

 

I've got some strange PDC errors from the rear sensors so I'll be stripping the boot down to check for water ingress.  I'll update it with some pictures when I've had chance.

 

Thanks again for all the info

 

Staff

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Sir Neil.D

:D

I've not got any errors being reported like the others that have posted, I've got 2 or 4 rear sensors showing up all the time. I stripped all the boot out today and it has a couple of holes drilled in the floor already so somebody's been in there already.

The roof has the rear panel jammed so it's not closing properly which is why I was suspecting the spare wheel well to be wet but it's all bone dry.

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Hi all

New to this forum and really joined as a result of getting this water ingress problem and doing a search.

I am going through the process of checking the drain tubes etc and was just wondering if anyone could confirm where the control box is located?

I have a 520d estate 2008 and most of the water has been in the right hand plastic bucket in the boot, the one with the first aid kit.

 

Thanks for all the great info in these posts, hopefully it'll save me a few quid in getting this sorted.

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hi guys i cant believe how many people have exactly the same problem as me!!

i have a 645 convertible,i noticed a few months ago that my car was constantly giving me a red transmission warning light,when i put my foot down..

after a cpl of weeks of this the warning light stayed on which then meant the car would only drive in 3rd gear...its an automatic.then literally every warning sign that could pop up has

had a bmw tec come and look at the car and naturally the wheel well had inches of water in it,the battery was swimming..

now although i had a comprehensive warranty that cost me £1700 the car wasnt covered due to water ingress now bmw have said its not worth getting the car repaired as it would cost more than the cars actual value.. its a 54 plate 90,000mls on the clock i could still get atleast 8k i think.providing it didnt have these problems

im in an on going dispute with BMW customer services,which is pretty pointless, so it seems.

so im now stuck with a car, sitting at cooper bmw in tonbridge whilst i decide on  what to do

 

does anyone have any advice on what to do.?or where to take the car for repair.?

 

i thank you in advance

phil

 

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Just feel foul of this in my M5 E61. I noticed the DAB unit on the left hand side had some rust marks, but thought nothing of it. Then one rainy day I parked on a hill, went to open the boot and it only moved a bit. I thought the battery was flat, but the car started. When I got going I had no end of error messages. Had a massive whirring noise in the back. I stopped and the self levelling suspension collapsed.

I did a very bumpy ride to the dealers and after a couple of days got a quote for £2400 to fix. As has been mentioned the sunroof drain decided to drain into the boot and fry all the electronics.

After a few discussions with the dealer and BMW UK they finally agreed to pay for parts but not labour (My car will be 5 years old in Nov).

I am still not happy, this is a design fault and they have now taken that pesky valve off. The problem is BMW is saying it has not been reported.

I think we might need to get a list of people with this problem and send in a mass complaint. This could have happened with a brand new car so age is irrelevant and theses electric bits don't fail.

Items that needed to be replaced where:

Air supply control unit

automatic boot control unit

LCPA module ????

tilt/slide control unit

DAB tuner

PDC unit

Total cost just labour was 937 inc VAT.

this was done at Fairfield Leigh on Sea, Clive the service manager was great and tried to help more, but without BMW acknowledging a problem this could happen to anyone. Adam at BMW UK claimed that I was lucky to get the parts paid for. I love this car, it is still the only car I want at the moment but this has got me so wound up.

Lets show some people power.

Ian

Had the same problem myself

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I also have this problem, but I've discovered it before any major damage is done. It generally looks quite dry in the E61 estate boot but today I have discovered water in both sides. I park on a slight slope facing up hill and I have the panoramic moon roof. I have tried pouring a little water in the channels on the sun roof and the water drained onto the road, on the battery side. I took the bumper off as I was fitting a tow bar and removed the rubber valve on the end of the drain hoses. The battery side one wasnt too bad but the other side was pretty blocked. the water seemed to drain quite freely even with the valves on once they were cleaned. I suspect water has got into the motors that control the luggage cover as they are playing up a bit. I think thats the route the water takes. I plan to buy new sun roof seals with the hope that I can prevent water getting into the sun roof. I must admit though, Im not sure that the water is coming in through the sun roof. Why would it come in the battery side which wasnt blocked? Annoyingly, my BMW is a replacement for a peugeot 406 which also had water in the boot problems!! Buying a newer and better quality car was meant to have been the solution!!!

 

Im not 100% sure this is where the water gets in.

 

One last thing Im going to try, Im going to put some ink into the sunroof channel. If I get coloured water in the boot I will know that the water has come from the sunroof. If the water is clear I will try inking arround the window seals with a different coloured ink.

Edited by azazel

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I've owned my 2008 535d touring with panoramic roof for just over a year or so. I'd noticed that when it rained heavily, I'd get random quirky behaviour of the idrive, DAB radio and occasional other faults. After a few days, the problems would gradually go away. It's then that I discovered this widespread problem of the roof drain pipes leaking in to the boot. This week, I stripped out the entire boot area to find this amateurish hotch potch of modules sitting in the base of the tyre well, sandwiched between two sheets of black polystyrene, they of course were still wet from that last water ingress. I drilled a 5mm hole in the bottom of the tyre well and Araldited a 90 degree bend pipe, so that the bit under the car points rearwards, to at least try and drain any excess water that might find its way in from the sunroof roof drain pipes.

 

I then followed suggestions on this and other forums and snipped off the crimped ends of both the left and right rear drain pipes and also blew through them to clear them. I then pushed the pipes back down through the wheel arch holes they fit into and left everything to dry out for a few days before reassembling the wacky polystyrene sandwich that BMW have concocted. It really is shoddy, I can't believe they thought it was a good idea to do it this way.

 

Anyway...

 

I then tested the rear drains today by pouring some water into the rain channels of the sunroof. Both rear pipes drained behind the rear tyres as intended but to my horror, the left side of the boot where the DAB radio module is located had a small cascade of water coming out of the trim, soaking the module once again (already rusty I guess due to many previous instances of water ingress).

 

My question, in case anyone has been able to work this out is:

 

if the pipes are clear, how is it that the water finds its way in to the rear inside left panel of the boot as well as flowing normally down inside the drain pipe?  Surely there must be something that is leaking further upstream. If this is the case, is it likely that the hose is partially disconnected at the sunroof drain end?  If so, how do I get to that end - do I need to remove the headlining and if so, do I have to remove all of it or is there a specific way to only remove enough to expose the rear drain exits off the sunroof cassette?

 

I know this seems like a lot of questions but surely I'm not the only one that has had this problem. The pipes are definitely not blocked now but I just can't understand how the water is running into the rear left side of the compartment.

 

Help please!!

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I had this problem earlier this year and found the issue to be where the drain tubes connect to the sunroof cartridge.

To fix all I had to do was pull down the back half of the roof lining and reattach the tubes this time using a couple of tie wraps to get a tighter fit.

I've had no further water ingress since, now the rear door cabling in the roof, thats another thing!

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Thanks Mike.  I guess upon reflection, the rearmost section of the sunroof cassette is probably not far from the back end of the car roof itself to allow for the glass when fully retracted.

 

I've had another quick look for any obvious hints on how to detach the rearmost section of the headlining and see none. There are also what seem to be a couple of speaker grilles mounted in the headlining just forward of the hatch area and I'm wondering how much give the wiring has if the headlining is removed.

 

Would you be able to let me know please how to detatch the rearmost part of the headlining?  I need to check those drain pipe joins before my car boot turns into another mobile paddling pool.

 

Thanks!

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Hi Phil

This is actually the very same problem I had and I needed to remove and clean the I-Drive boards and relays before getting to this point.

 

The head lining at the top rear of the boot comes down quite easily but there are a couple of plastic clips stuck onto the lining that clip into the car roof. These just get broken off and could be re-stuck prior to replacing the lining if required, though the lining is stiff enough to stay up with out them and mine is now held up by being clipped behind the boot seal at the top, is hasn't sagged so I'm happy so far.

 

The speaker grills also just unclip and can be replaced quite easily. If you haven't had an issue with the remote locking or the radio memory you will have before long and will need to remove these grills for that issue as well.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

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I removed the rear bumper on my 2007 E61 LCI this weekend to exchange two faulty PDC sensors. With the bumper off I thought I would finally get around removing the pinched outlets of the sunroof drains but was surprised to find that I had none. I highly doubt that the previous owner have removed them so I suspect that BMW might have ditched the outlets on the LCI models, but that would need to be confirmed by some more LCI owners.

 

Bumper.jpg

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mny best advice to anyone is

sell the friggin car if you have these problems and stay away from the main dealer

BMW told me over 6thousand yet i had it up and running when my mechanic replaced the fuse box which had been wet

now the car is just tempremental

im trying to repair everything so the next person doesnt have all this grief also..

NIGHTMARE

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hey mike thank you for the tips

i now seem to get other things goin on the car  runs but when i first start it the transmission light comes on the red warning i leave it for a min then restart the car and fine.

really pissing me off now..

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Agreed this is a bit of a nightmare, given that new, these cars are over £50k and frankly, in over 30 years of car ownership my first ever beemer has given me the most hassle of any car I've owned. Nevertheless, I love the drive, it's fantastically quick (remapped 535d) and yet on a motorway run, I can get 48-50 mpg if I just blend in with the traffic flow.

Therefore, I think it deserves some TLC. As for BMW, I applaud them for the things that I like as mentioned above but they deserve a right proper spanking for the shoddy attention to detail such as the sunroof water pipes issue, particularly when they decide to shove a load of electronics in the bottom of the tyre well, just to add to the grief. I will soldier on, I'd really like to get this sorted out once and for all and get this lovely motor back to its best.

I'm going to post separately on the subject of the DPF, things that I've learned about it, hopefully this will be useful for other diesel Beemer drivers and save them some cash.  Will let you know how I get on with the roof leak...

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