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Mr_530i

No more Manual BMW - Well 3 Series that is!

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http://www.thedrive.com/news/23967/bmw-waves-goodbye-to-the-3-series-manual-transmission

 

I can only see one pro to this: 

 

I think this will only push the value of old BMWs up.

 

Drivers that can't use a manual properly will probably be able to drive faster

 

Cons: 

 

New generation of drivers will not know how to control a real car over the coming years, just like most people these days can't double clutch ( +1) but back in the days this use to be the norm  

 

Feel less in control of the car

 

and so much more............

 

TBH I think BMW have lots their touch in new cars, more about the looks then the drive and quality of the build. 

 

 

Edited by Mr_530i

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6 minutes ago, Mr_530i said:

 

New generation of drivers will not know how to control a real car over the coming years, just like most people these days can't double clutch ( +1) but back in the days this use to be the norm

 

 

 

They won't need to as moving forward most car manufacturers will be building more autonomous vehicles. People will have to buy a classic car if they want the classic driving experience.

 

Modern cars are great for the daily commute and run out in comfort, however they'll never be as involving or stir the senses like a classic.

 

C.

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Drives don’t know how to control cars correctly now (the newer generations) so really, it’s not going to make any difference!

 

Drivers are taught by the books these days, very regimented etc...  

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I don't see this hurting their sales at all.  For most people, the 8 speed Steptronic box is all they'll ever need.  You can control that manually if you wish, but to be honest there's not much to be gained by doing so.  The 8 speed is a great box in my opinion anyway.  I have no complaints about the way my F10 goes with it in there.

 

Still, I would have thought they might have left one performance manual in the range somewhere. 

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Ah the good old days when a three series needed a bag of cement in the boot during icy conditions to prevent visits to the ditches.   As Monty Python would have observed,   "Try telling that to young folks nowdays and they won't believe you"

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They need more gears in cars that have engines that have been strangled to meet emmision rules. More gears means auto to allow the strangled engine to stay in its sweet spot of very short useful rpms. If you have driven a manual 520d you will know what I mean.

 

I don't need 8 speeds in my car. Six is plenty. Using the paddles means you need to down shift to 4th or 3rd to get any form of engine braking on twisty roads. 

 

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4 hours ago, Calypso-E34 said:

I

Still, I would have thought they might have left one performance manual in the range somewhere. 

 

But DSG type boxes are faster than traditional manuals i thought - as cars have got faster and faster its the gear change that slows things down.

 

I'm a manual fan but i can see their days are numbered.

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2 hours ago, 535i Andrew said:

 Using the paddles means you need to down shift to 4th or 3rd to get any form of engine braking on twisty roads. 

 

 

Actually that IS one thing I have noticed.  Coming down from 8th to 6th or even 5th makes sod all difference to your engine braking.  I like it otherwise though.  My car is a 525d, which is a pretty big car -  and it never feels anything less than sprightly.

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7 hours ago, duncan-uk said:

 I'm a manual fan but i can see their days are numbered.

Me too. An auto is very nice crawling through traffic, but a surprising number of drivers are very poor at using a manual 'box. There was something very satisfying about snicking up through the box on a nice twisty 'A' road. .  :D

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18 hours ago, pidgeonpost said:

There was something very satisfying about snicking up through the box on a nice twisty 'A' road. .  :D

 

Similarly if it's an auto in sports mode, using the paddles can be fun.

 

But a twisty Scottish B road in a manual 520d is not fun at all. It's like mixing concrete with a wooden spoon.

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I had an E30 in the early 90's and this left the road once one a fast run to the station down a frosty country lane near home but it merely bounced off a bank and I continued  without any damage ( albeit at a slower pace and reconciled to missing my normal train). I had to abandon another journey to work when the same car would not climb a snowy road on a hill. I was stuck while Metros and Minis sailed past. Yes the bag of cement in the boot was not a myth.

 

I suspect however that the long term future of road travel will be by driverless cars used like taxis. Think of the infrastructure savings. Luckily though I shall be long gone by then.

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15 minutes ago, stevecvo said:

I suspect however that the long term future of road travel will be by driverless cars used like taxis. Think of the infrastructure savings. Luckily though I shall be long gone by then.

2

 

 I imagine people of the future will have to get permission to travel before their smart cars allow them to move :ph34r:

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1 hour ago, 535i Andrew said:

 

Similarly if it's an auto in sports mode, using the paddles can be fun.

 

But a twisty Scottish B road in a manual 520d is not fun at all. It's like mixing concrete with a wooden spoon.

There are just two things I wish our 525d had - a manual gearbox...and a petrol engine!  :lol:

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There is no doubt that the DCT is better than a manual, I just like driving a manual, I’m not in a race, I just want to enjoy getting where I’m going. I also realise that there are not enough people like me to make a manual option viable to BMW. I’ll make the most of mine. 

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I would never have still bought one of my BMWs if it had a manual. I go firstly on engine then spec. The gears are lower down the list. 

 

Given my costly experience with fixing automatic gearboxes, if my F10 had a manual box with that engine, spec and towbar I would still have bought it.

 

My mum had an auto Carlton which I got to drive at 18, it was a lovely waftomatic barge and quick enough in 2.0i form. 

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Modern boxes are better I'm  sure but even the e39 (my last auto) I found dim witted. 

 

Say you're on the motorway and want to accelerate. a small push produces nothing in acceleration press a bit harder hoping to use the torque and it drops down one or two gears 

 

with the manual I just press the pedal as far as I want and gain speed without the increase in revs from a down change. 

 

Im driving briskly but not on it. I want to change down for a corner so I do in advance and hold the gear whilst off the power then accelerate through. The auto in the mean time would have changed up and then kicked down. 

 

Yes you you can use the manual override but I just prefer a clutch and a manual box. 

 

Driving in hilly Devon lanes i wanted to hold a gear on the down hill to get some engine breaking but it wants to run away and change up. So I have to down change manually to get the effect I want. 

 

Maybe I expect too much

 

Unless in stop start m25 traffic then I wonder why I don't like autos. :rolleyes:

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More sophisticated the car and transmission the more to go wrong and the earlier to the scrappy as un economical to repair. The more valuable a good classic becomes mind :D

 

I've seen how kids drive today and tbh it's no better than when I learned. There are too many crap drivers on the road these days. Testing should be done every 5 years to get rid of those who really shouldn't have passed and those who are no longer able to pass. Driving in general should be a privilege not a right.....

 

Oh and there definitely should not be an option to have an automatic licence.

 

 

Whinge over.  :lol:

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6 hours ago, duncan-uk said:

Modern boxes are better I'm  sure but even the e39 (my last auto) I found dim witted. 

 

There is a world of difference between the 5 speed auto box in the E39 and the one in, say, the F10.  I don't have any experience of the E60 so I couldn't tell you what that's like, but I'd say it's closer to the E39 than the F10.

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I do realise they are the way forward; allowing the engine to work in a specific optimised power band for maximum efficiency and i'm sure very competent but its another thing taken away from "driving" a car. Its progress i know but newer isn't always better in terms of how it makes you feel.

 

 

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Hypothetically I just don't want to end up in a situation that because I choose to drive a BMW auto as my daily I forget how to drive a manual. Also driving an auto means you can afford to have a more relaxed driving approach such as allowing your car to creep forward or backwards or just constantly drive with one hand, whereas in a manual you have to be more aware, as its less forgiving, such as if your not concentrating you could be in the wrong gear or stall. I also like to be able to coast, when parallel parking, for instance reserving up a hill but dipping the clutch in to go forward whilst still being in reverse, you can't do this in auto. 

 

But I do like Duncan-uk would prefer to be in auto when in traffic. 

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Our E60 is only the second auto we've owned, and as our second car has a manual box I haven't lost the knack - yet. Regarding Duncan's observation about lack of engine braking, I've noticed this too, but often dab the cruise control which holds the speed. Not ideal, and I'm not sure what mechanisms come into play when I do this - i.e. does the gearbox take control and hold the selected gear thus causing engine braking, or are the brakes activated on your behalf? Can't say I like the idea of the brakes being applied as it must be like 'riding the brakes'. I've often wondered if the brake lights are also activated when I activate cruise to hold the speed downhill. I've never remembered to test it, but it would probably get right up the nose of the driver following behind!

Edit: Having hacked through Buckingham, Bicester, Witney, Chipping Norton, and Stowe today I was very happy to have an auto! :lol:

Edited by pidgeonpost

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