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BarryM

Rust above bumper

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Yet another thread about rust! I have the car booked in this week for the usual rust above the bumper:

151218771_2018-05-2713_58_33.thumb.jpg.b7aae45872ad9550ee4082734cbd8f70.jpg

 

1582292829_2018-05-2713_58_16.thumb.jpg.36889e53e70b8f4cd549f0e378b1b656.jpg

 

Yesterday I removed the plastic inner boot cover and saw this:

 

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2086861855_2018-05-2713_56_11b.jpg.89fcde2b6d94cdd7d798b9da5d7af5d1.jpg

 

Those last 2 images are upside down but can't seem to save & paste the right way up but they are directly behind the outside rust so has anyone had the same rust repaired and did the bodyshop cut into the car and repair the inner rust as well - does the metal need to be cut out & welded?

 

 

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Very common place for rust on the E39s

 

Metal is quite thick there; so may be fine with it being sanded back, treated and then filled/primer'd and resprayed etc 

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Thanks for the replies, car dropped off at the body shop this afternoon.

 

1 hour ago, lufbramatt said:

Take the bumper off and see wha the rear apron is like 

 

Bumper definitely being removed and I now realise the 2 holes are visible with that  off

 

7 hours ago, Liam79 said:

And squirt waxoyl in that cavity afterwards.

 

I'm thinking waxoyl or maybe a Bilt Hamber product

 

7 hours ago, amazighman said:

While you are at it check also under the boot opening rubber seal

 

All good under the rubber seal.

 

He's also removing some rust around the number plate lights, and spraying up an M5 spoiler for me as well as one of the door mirror pods.

 

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Repair completed but not entirely happy!

 

The rust has been removed and he's sealed the rubber bungs in place but if you look closely you can see them: 

1068217635_Rustrepair.jpg.55adb42239627d9edbaff86a6b12dae7.jpg

 

He's also put the bumper back on but left a gap between it and the body:

1445299308_2018-06-1018_20_37.jpg.b30f45035541bff95fae25196ecda8c5.jpg

 

Hopefully removing the bumper is simple enough as I'm not taking it back for him to put right.

 

Ironically the paintwork is quite good but overall I won't be going back to him.

 

 

 

 

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Once these things are off, it’s generally impossible to get them sitting right again. It’s like things go soft etc

 

Hopefully you’ll get it sorted, but the more you mess, the more it may sag etc

Edited by d_a_n1979

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How did he remove rust? I have had very little success using rust converters.

 

My tried and tested method is to use rust removers like Jenolite or Deox gel untill all rust is removed and the pits are clear then repaint, no rust ever came back.

 

Could you tell us how much this paint job costed?

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50 minutes ago, d_a_n1979 said:

Once these things are off, it’s generally impossible to get them sitting right again. It’s like things go soft etc

Hopefully you’ll get it sorted, but the more you mess, the more it may sag etc

 

I find the E39 is a great car to take apart and put back together, in my experience everything fits back properly as long as you take your time and make sure you do things in the right order, so I'll be removing it at the weekend. Taking a quick look I see the 3 main nuts holding the bumper either side are sitting lower then originally so hopefully not too tricky but both wheel arch liners look to be a bit 'out' as well. 

 

31 minutes ago, amazighman said:

How did he remove rust? I have had very little success using rust converters.

 

My tried and tested method is to use rust removers like Jenolite or Deox gel untill all rust is removed and the pits are clear then repaint, no rust ever came back.

 

Could you tell us how much this paint job costed?

 

He ground the rust off and used Fertan which I guess is a variation on Jenolite or Deox.

 

I had the 2 rust spots done along with a small patch by one of the number plate lights and also an M5 spoiler and one of my mirror pods sprayed.

 

Cost was £300

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3 hours ago, BarryM said:

 

I find the E39 is a great car to take apart and put back together, in my experience everything fits back properly as long as you take your time and make sure you do things in the right order, so I'll be removing it at the weekend. Taking a quick look I see the 3 main nuts holding the bumper either side are sitting lower then originally so hopefully not too tricky but both wheel arch liners look to be a bit 'out' as well. 

 

 

He ground the rust off and used Fertan which I guess is a variation on Jenolite or Deox.

 

I had the 2 rust spots done along with a small patch by one of the number plate lights and also an M5 spoiler and one of my mirror pods sprayed.

 

Cost was £300

Thanks...300 quid is very reasonable well done.

 

Fertan is a rust converter with tannic acid as active ingredient, it doesn't remove rust it just converts it, but if any pits or deep rust left it will highly likely reoccur.

Jenolite however is a a phosphoric acid based which eats away the rust and leaves the metal clean , i like to apply it and reapply and wire brush untill virtually no rust left and pits all clear, then no rust comes back again.

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Only well done if the rust doesn’t come back! I have to rely on the chap that he removed all the rust...

I will also remove the bumper and fit it flush as well as seeing if I can tidy up the rubber bungs.

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That's just how the bungs are, isn't it? They have a lip that sits proud of the body. I don't see how you would not see them when you look in that gap.

 

A bit hard for me to judge from the pics - maybe your gap between bumper and body is a little excessive now, but it's always there. Again hard to tell, but the gap looked similar in your pre-job pics. E39 isn't like a modern car where the bumper is kinda integral with the bodywork - it's an old school separate bulgy bumper. If you could adjust it up so the bumper touches the bodywork I think you'd just get trapped water and the two painted surfaces rubbing.

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1 hour ago, Liam79 said:

That's just how the bungs are, isn't it? They have a lip that sits proud of the body. I don't see how you would not see them when you look in that gap.

 

A bit hard for me to judge from the pics - maybe your gap between bumper and body is a little excessive now, but it's always there. Again hard to tell, but the gap looked similar in your pre-job pics. E39 isn't like a modern car where the bumper is kinda integral with the bodywork - it's an old school separate bulgy bumper. If you could adjust it up so the bumper touches the bodywork I think you'd just get trapped water and the two painted surfaces rubbing.

 

Fair point Liam, what I'm not happy about is the sealant standing out (although I had never seen the bungs when I looked previously).

 

I agree a very small gap needs to be there but he's somehow managed to have a minimum gap in the middle and bigger gap at either side of the car, I'm gonna take it off and start again and hopefully remove or tidy up the sealant. 

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Ah fair enough hope you can tidy it up. I've had my rear bumper on and off a bunch of times for tow bar fitting and parking sensor replacement and never noticed its position changing, but I'm probably not looking as critically as you! :)

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So I took the boot cover out and took another look inside and see a couple of very small patches of rust still visible :(

 

176474367_2018-06-1320_47_39.jpg.5b89c4bcb6261fe80832f0cee3dab0de.jpg1739629796_2018-06-1320_44_24.jpg.91336ef5d0a97918fb8a9d01ff4b02ca.jpg

 

Once I have the bumper off I'll remove the bungs and use Bilt Hamber Deox gel followed by spraying some Dynax S50 over the area. I guess I need to pay more money for a proper job in future but rather annoyingly the paint finish he did is very good.

 

Edited by BarryM

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5 hours ago, BarryM said:

So I took the boot cover out and took another look inside and see a couple of very small patches of rust still visible :(

 

176474367_2018-06-1320_47_39.jpg.5b89c4bcb6261fe80832f0cee3dab0de.jpg1739629796_2018-06-1320_44_24.jpg.91336ef5d0a97918fb8a9d01ff4b02ca.jpg

 

Once I have the bumper off I'll remove the bungs and use Bilt Hamber Deox gel followed by spraying some Dynax 50 over the area. I guess I need to pay more money for a proper job in future but rather annoyingly the paint finish he did is very good.

 

Deox gel works best if can be covered in shrink wrap or so to stop it drying.

Most of body shops will only treat visible rust, they wont check behind the panels and bungs and we wonder why rust comes back.

I prefer to remove the rust myself and then prime it and get someone to do the top coat

 

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4 hours ago, amazighman said:

Deox gel works best if can be covered in shrink wrap or so to stop it drying.

 

My other option is Hydrate 80, planning to remove bungs and smear inside with a gloved finger

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Hydrate 80 is a rust converter, it will work best if area is wire brushed till all bulk of rust is  gone then apply hydrate 80.

I assume you dont have access the clean the rust around those bungs from inside, that make it tricky, perhaps use Jenolite numerous times untill rust is removed...but again Jenolite works best if put on a wire brushed area and then  agitated with a small wire brush for good penetration.

 

You could try a dremel with a flexible extension and wire brush  to get in there from boot and wire brush around the bungs

 

Edited by amazighman

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I used Hydrate 80 to paint over the tiny bits of rust left inside and then sprayed Dynax S50 using the injection lance (never used this product before but super easy and very impressive result). I think I've done all I can to stop the rot short of cutting out the metal but time will tell!

 

636069704_2018-06-1710_36_02.jpg.770a8424691dab859fe027ed343174cb.jpg

 

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